Pushing the Naruto myth off the cliff regarding, believe, meaning

amy

This thread is to end the Naruto myth and push it off the cliff.
There seems to be a misunderstanding regarding this line:

quot;I believe you're the only one who can surpass the Yondaime Hokagequot;.

This is Kakashi talking to Naruto. However, many disregard its meaning and decide to blow it out of proportion, ie quot;Yondaime was the strongest Hokagequot;.

Yet databook/manga stated Sandaime takes this title.

The professor/Sandaime, #27508;#20195;#26368;#24375;#12398;#28779;#24433; quot;strongest Hokage in historyquot;.

Conclusion: Something is wrong.

Let me explain. Naruto is Yondaime's son. He is destined to learn his jutsu, to uphold the Yondaime's wish when Kyuubi was sealed within his little body.

Still, the implication is not that Yondaime's strength = unmatched. Even if this were the case or Kakashi thought so, it is not to be found in this sentence.

Read and contemplate whether it makes sense or not:

quot;Konohamaru, you're the last hope to become like Sandaime.quot;

quot;Haruno Sakura, only you can surpass legendary Tsunade.quot;

quot;Shikamaru, I'm sure only you will overshadow your father.quot;

This thread has my Uchiha Seal of Approval

I just wanna know what jutsu that is.

Great thread Seiko. Surpassing Yondaime is a reference to Yondaimes development of Rasengan... not to Yondaime the shinobi. Anyone can see that this was a misinterpretation of a translation... where the Data Book is very clear.

You know how Shodai ended up being a lot stronger than you thought?

It's a pattern which is common. Yondaime is going to receive some major hype and i'd rather let the manga do the talking. He's going to be the strongest Hokage, he's the benchmark for the main protagonist. Simple story device.

Heh, the plot holes have been found once again.

i thought the myth was some sort of urban legend!

I get what you're saying seiko.

quot;only you can surpass tsunadequot; meaning that sakura will be the only one better than tsunade in THAT aspect of fighting and medical ninjutsu.

The same thing can be said about yondaime.however i don't think it will only be the rasengan i'm sure there are other ascpects to MINATO's style of fightning that naruto will improve on.Hence why only naruto can surpass yondaime, because naruto will be the only one to fight like yondaime but more improved (Not sure that's even possible but that's what i get)

OK i think i might know the story here is my take:

It is said that Yondaime is quot;the greatest ninja Konoha ever producedquot;.

And the Databook says the greatest hokage was Sandaime. Now why would Kakasi say that about the Rasengan, its jsut a move. I do not think it's a plot hole i think the databook means he did a better job at hokage(i don't understand how this could be true though) and Yondy was a better Ninja(which im guessing is true).

So i don't neccicarrilly think its a plot hole its that you ar reading over a few words.


Originally Posted by Seikoquot;Shikamaru, I'm sure only you will overshadow your father.quot;

Lol punny. :3

And also, agreed.


Originally Posted by lessonnumbersixLol punny. :3

You noticed.

And also, agreed.

Thanks.

Yodaime was a genius, and so are all who become Hokage, in their own ways.

this thread only deals with one sentence.  In that, you lose the context and attack the myth from the wrong point.  You forget that Jiraiya, who knew the power of both Sarutobi and Minato, said that Minato was the greatest shinobi ever.


Originally Posted by GenesisYou know how Shodai ended up being a lot stronger than you thought?

It's a pattern which is common. Yondaime is going to receive some major hype and i'd rather let the manga do the talking. He's going to be the strongest Hokage, he's the benchmark for the main protagonist. Simple story device.

Exactly.

The protagonists benchmark is second to none until the protagonist over takes the top spot.

This is a shonen manga for God's sake, not something that needs deep thought to understand. Not everything will make sense, but it doesn't have to. It's fun entertainment.

I think yondy was the best talent wise, but he didn't live long enough to realize his potential. sandy was known for mastering tons of jutsu. yondy was known for creating a bunch of jutsu. therefore, surpassing yondy could be seen as more impressive.
The myth is still on the cliff Seiko. You pushed but not hard enough

Still, the implication is not that Yondaime's strength = unmatched.

O'rly?
quot;That unrivaled strength.quot;

Contradictions exist all throughout the Naruto manga. Also, don't use examples of inferior shinobi like Karin and Neji to make a counter-point, because all you're doing now is disrespecting Yondaime and how powerful he actually was. And if you want to call quot;unrivaled strengthquot; hype, then it how could you not consider being called quot;God of Shinobiquot; the most ultimate form of hype? If he was really a God, he'd be alive, as gods don't die. And there's two or three guys I'm seeing in the manga that is stronger than this God of Shinobi, so that reputation crutch isn't a stable as you might think. I've always found that when people try and restrict and limit Yondaime's level, most every argument was ultimately dismantled. Back then, years ago, when the Sannin were unbeatable Gods, Minato was only a shoe-shining replacement who wasn't even worth any elite guy's time, he wasn't that geat a genius, and he was only Konoha's greatest Hokage because of what he did against Kyuubi, and then I was reading that he didn't even have the strength to back up his own reputation.

How's that working out now? So really, stop limiting him. Because his story's far from done at this point, I promise you. You will hear his name several more time in this Arc and before the series ends.

Basically, at the beginning, Naruto said he wanted to surpass all Hokage, and then singled out the Fourth one. Hint, hint?

The Tsunade/Shikaku points are fair ones, but neither of the two are constantly being discussed as being the greatest, and neither (like, especially Shikaku) have been as built up or have connections as strong to the central plot as Minato does.


Originally Posted by The Fourth Hokagethis thread only deals with one sentence.  In that, you lose the context and attack the myth from the wrong point.  You forget that Jiraiya, who knew the power of both Sarutobi and Minato, said that Minato was the greatest shinobi ever.

That might just be a sign of how much respect both Jiraiya and Kakashi have for their own senseis. Plus Kakashi might just be referring to Minato due to the relation between Naruto and him, not necessarily because he was the best of the best.

Plus Minato died fairly young, he probably didn't meet his full potential, while Sarutobi had plenty of time to develop--and that's probably why he might be considered better, even if Minato had more potential.

Anyone else notice how Sandaime kind of looked up to Minato?

Forget looking up to him, NR.

Minato caused Sandaime to change from the guy who wasn't so worried about every individual to caring about all of them as family.

Look at his reaction to Tsunade when she asks for medic-nins to be placed on teams so there is immediate help. Then look at him staring at Yondaime's face on the monument and claiming everyone is important; quot;just like you used to.quot;

Minato inspired the guy.